[Dxspider-support] [Fwd: Dx Spot Beacon]

Bob Applegate bob.applegate at ulticom.com
Thu Oct 27 18:49:57 BST 2005 

I don't know about other areas, but around here, we have only a single
node on a given frequency.  So, all UI frames could be interpreted by
the cluster (ie, UI commands from users) as being "for" the cluster.  If
it's not a valid command, then the cluster just ignores it.  Otherwise, it
acts upon the command.

It seems there are two groups of users... those who are serious users of
the node who intend on issuing commands, posting spots, etc, and then
another group that basically just wants to receive spots and occasionally
post one.  For the serious users, connecting is the most logic way to
work with the node.  

For casual users, just remain unconnected, and have limited commands
available.  Ignore "sh" commands from them, since the output goes to
all the unconnected users.  Ie, "limited users" are just that... they have
limited access to the node.  If they want more, then they should connect.

Yes, UI frames might be dropped.  I wouldn't worry about it.  Again,
someone not connected doesn't get all the advantages that a connected
user does.  Most of the casual guys probably don't care if they get
every single spot or not, so they'd probably be happy to both use the
node and still contribute an occasional spot without slowing down the
frequency with more ACKs.

Bob - K2UT

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Bob Nielsen" <nielsen at oz.net>
To: "The DXSpider Support list" <dxspider-support at dxcluster.org>
Sent: Thursday, October 27, 2005 12:24 PM
Subject: Re: [Dxspider-support] [Fwd: Dx Spot Beacon]


> It would require addressing the cluster node in the data packet  
> itself, such as is done with tcp/ip or APRS messaging.  This would  
> add a bit of overhead, of course.  Smart client software would be  
> needed to filter out the data and allow for the ability to send  
> commands, which probably would be easiestly done with KISS-mode TNCs  
> using AGW or Linux.  I see the equivalent of "sh/dx" as being a  
> client command which would re-display stored spot data.
> 
> Bob, N7XY
> 
> On Oct 27, 2005, at 8:53 AM, Eric Carling wrote:
> 
> > what about the more fundamental problem that UI frames cannot be  
> > directed to a specific station (ie the cluster) and hence any  
> > commands contained therein will be ignored?
> >
> > -------Original Message-------
> >
> > From: Bob Applegate
> > Date: 10/27/05 15:27:55
> > To: N8DCJ at yahoo.com; The DXSpider Support list
> > Subject: Re: [Dxspider-support] [Fwd: Dx Spot Beacon]
> >
> > This would be a nice feature.  Most users simply suck spots off the  
> > cluster
> > anyway, so it would reduce the amount of traffic (ACKs) on the  
> > frequency
> > while still allowing them to contribute.
> >
> > Since you're not connected, how would a command like "sh/dx" work?   
> > It's
> > a UI still, right?  That means everyone gets flooded with the  
> > results of
> > each
> > others' requests.  I'd suggest limiting the available commands that
> > unconnected
> > users can do, such as allowing spots, announce messages, etc.
> >
> > Bob - K2UT
> >
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: "Dan Bookwalter" <n8dcj at yahoo.com>
> > To: <iz5fsa at tele2.it>; "The DXSpider Support list"
> > <dxspider-support at dxcluster.org>
> > Sent: Thursday, October 27, 2005 11:10 AM
> > Subject: Re: [Dxspider-support] [Fwd: Dx Spot Beacon]
> >
> >
> > > this doesnt seem to be too hard to accomplish on the
> > > surface... then again i am not the programmer ;-)
> > >
> > > the only issue i see is that since you are not
> > > "connected" your command may/will get lost at times
> > > and you would have to resend the sh/dx or whatever...
> > > i do something like this at work with UDP packets
> > > between a couple of applications...
> > >
> > > Dan N8DCJ
> > >
> > > --- iz5fsa at tele2.it wrote:
> > >
> > > > I have a Linux server to manage the fle(X)net node
> > > > and the
> > > > spider, so no AGW and UI-Bridge capabilities.
> > > > However this
> > > > is a good idea to beacon spots.
> > > >
> > > > But I don't want just to beacon spots.
> > > >
> > > > Listen to me, guys...
> > > >
> > > > 1) I need a beacon function that allow node "to
> > > > beacon" UI
> > > > spots on a certain ax25 port
> > > > so listeners (clients) can ear spots (1 spot send by
> > > > node
> > > > serve all clients once).
> > > >
> > > > 2) I want a new "protocol" connection between node
> > > > and
> > > > clients with "no protocol", as UI packet. When I am
> > > > on the
> > > > frequency, I put my tnc in converse mode and I want
> > > > the
> > > > node recognize me as registered user "on demand"
> > > > without
> > > > logging in, when I send him a command as UI packet.
> > > > I need
> > > > a function that allow me to use the commands, for
> > > > example:
> > > > sh/qrz
> > > > sh/usdb
> > > > sh/425
> > > > sh/dx
> > > > even if not logged in, simply sending them as UI
> > > > frames.
> > > >
> > > > Results:
> > > > a) less traffic on air
> > > > b) users logged only if necessary
> > > > c) flexibility to use local qrg for dx-cluster
> > > > monitor
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > thanks to all and 73s de Leo, IZ5FSA
> > > >
> > > > On Thu, 27 Oct 2005 13:29:02 +0000 (GMT Standard
> > > > Time)
> > > >   "Eric Carling" <eric at g0cgl.f2s.com> wrote:
> > > > > His first requirement, to send UI (unproto) frames
> > > >
> > > > >containing DX spots, WWV
> > > > > and ANN, is done with AGW and a client
> > > > application,
> > > > >either AGWCluster or
> > > > > UI-Bridge found at
> > > > > http://www.apritch.myby.co.uk/addon_agw.htm
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > -------Original Message-------
> > > > >
> > > > >From: Dirk Koopman
> > > > > Date: 10/27/05 12:45:48
> > > > > To: Dxspider-Support
> > > > > Subject: [Dxspider-support] [Fwd: Dx Spot Beacon]
> > > > >
> > > > > I seem to remember that some people have done
> > > > something
> > > > >along these
> > > > > lines. Could we discuss it on here please.
> > > > >
> > > > > Dirk G1TLH
> > > > > -------- Forwarded Message --------
> > > > >From: iz5fsa at tele2.it
> > > > > Reply-To: iz5fsa at tele2.it
> > > > > To: djk at tobit.co.uk
> > > > > Subject: Dx Spot Beacon
> > > > > Date: Thu, 27 Oct 2005 12:22:43 +0200
> > > > > Hi Dirk,
> > > > > I don't want you to loose your time... I have a
> > > > problem,
> > > > >a
> > > > > question and a (im)possible(?) solution. Please
> > > > answer
> > > > >to
> > > > > me... every thing you think about it!
> > > > >
> > > > > I have my 2mt 1k2b ax25 node access full of
> > > > access...
> > > > >too
> > > > > many ham operators!!!
> > > > >
> > > > > I'm looking for a new way of handling protocol
> > > > between
> > > > > node and clients.
> > > > >
> > > > > A new style that admit a very few list of commands
> > > > to
> > > > >use
> > > > > in unproto mode without logon and that send any
> > > > dx,
> > > > > announce, WWV or WCY spot not in
> > > > > "node-to-each-connected-station" mode but only in
> > > > > "node-to-all" mode, just like a beacon.
> > > > >
> > > > > All stations can send specific strings command
> > > > (like
> > > > > "sh/qrz g1djk" and few other most used inquiry, DX
> > > > and
> > > > >ANN
> > > > > command) in unproto message to communicate with
> > > > the node
> > > > > and have answers by the node.
> > > > >
> > > > > All stations will receive dx, announce, WWV or WCY
> > > > spot
> > > > > not in "node-to-each-connected-station" mode but
> > > > only in
> > > > > "node-to-all" mode, just like a beacon.
> > > > >
> > > > > Packet Clients don't use this way of work if they
> > > > are
> > > > > connected to a node, but in "earing mode" like the
> > > > one
> > > > > used by rxcluster it will work... and putting tnc
> > > > in
> > > > > converse mode permit to work in this new way!
> > > > >
> > > > > I think it will be a good way to use
> > > > frequencies...
> > > > >
> > > > > What do you think about?
> > > > >
> > > > > 73s de Leo, IZ5FSA
> > > > > --
> > > > > Dirk Koopman <djk at tobit.co.uk>
> > > > >
> > > > >
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